February 5, 2012

Kenmore 117.841 (1958)

After seeing and reading about the Kenmores that were made in Germany I went for one that came up on CL; I got all the cams and the manual with it too (made in 1958). After a lot of cleaning she looks pretty good.
"The "Kenmore 84" was, according to White, a product of American and Germany ingenuity. It was a zig-zag sewing machine which sold for the rather large sum of $239.95 in 1956" ISMACS 

Kenmore machine dating can be found at SN





Note: partial quote from Bill Holman,
"You are probably aware that the first digits in the Sears model # tell you who made it, and that 117 is the Sears source # for White. That being said, White did not make yours. You are correct about the time line, and this machine was made at a time when White was realizing that they could not survive without a ZZ machine, and could not afford to develop one. They also knew that if they could not offer a ZZ machine to Sears, they were going to lose the Sears contract to Japan, which eventually happened anyway. So White contracted with Gritzner-Kayser in Germany to manufacture a machine for them, and the same machine as a Kenmore, but cosmetically different."



The Kenmore badge drops down to access the cams. Like the Selecto-Matic of the same era it has a sort of pre war Locomotive style of engineering and general approach to detail that fast went away in the following decades. I think it's quiet and starts up more smoothly than most, the motor runs well at low speed too. Like the Necchi BU it has a fine thread adjustment on the upper thread tension knob; I like it better than the course adjustment style. 


This is one serious dog of a Chrysler, got the paint scheme but the homely mushy curves are old looking even for the 50's. This is where the sewing machines got a little ahead of cars; the rectilinear styling didn't come along in cars till the 70's.







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69 comments:

  1. Your German made Kenmore looks kind of manly to me. Perhaps it is the copper/white colour scheme. Do you like sewing with it? Have you sewn anything interesting with it?

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    1. Yes it does have an authoritarian look bout it doesn't it? "You Vill sew mit me!"

      I have not sewn any projects with it, I'm looking forward to giving the Remington a run at the next opportunity.

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    2. I have this machine and it doesn’t looking completely copper. It kind of has a mauve cast to it! That is one of the reasons I bought it.

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  2. What a beauty! I just found one on CL myself and I'm looking forward to using it. What foot pedal should I use with it? I LOVE the color and look of it! Just my style. Tuff.

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  3. I just purchased my kenmore model 47 but it did not come with the cams. do you have any leads as to how to locate someone with this knowledge?

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    1. @scrappy. Looks like we're gonna have to battle for the only set of existing cams for this machine, that's if they ever come up for auction on ebay. I'm having a hard time finding a foot pedal myself (cams too, but I want to at least see if it works). Looks like the .9 amp motor wasn't very popular. Be ready for a bidding war! LOL! Let me know if you see anything out there.

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    2. To me it's just an endless search in all the right places. I am not so concerned about getting the cams since no-one ever uses them, they seem to be critical towards resale pricing though. so if you can keep your eyes open and wait I'm sure they will come along.

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    3. I also wonder how much this machine is worth. I have one in the original cabinet with cams,most other attachments, the owners manual and even thread, needles and other items from the 50's and 60's. It was given to me by a friend. I use it and love it!

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  4. hi i have a kenmore 117.840 without a bobbin case. im just wondering can i get a regular kemore bobbin case or am i better off just getting a new machine?

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    1. Hi Zyuwnai, definitely give a chance, I think these are extremely common bobbin cases maybe $15 or less. You might find a used one from a sewing machine repair guy. Be sure to give it a good oiling and good luck.

      Tom

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  5. I have one of these old machines, it has a foot pedal and works fine so far.. I have no idea what cams are? looking for more info on this machine.. mine is in a huge heavy case that flips up with the machine attached,,where can I find more info on this?? the info on the brass plate on back is
    Kenmore sears robuck simpson
    sears limited Canada
    model 117, 841 serial number 979984
    60 cycle 100 watts 9 amps. any info would be great.

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    1. Hi Megan, it is a great machine, make sure your oil it up!
      Running these old machines is a bit like being an engineer on a old steam engine; you have to get to know and love your machine to get the satisfaction out of it you've earned.
      It's pretty much a 1958 machine, I suggest doing a deep dive on the net reading every thread you can find. The cams go under the name badge door in the front, all you really need is straight & ZZ.

      have fun and good luck.

      Tom

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  6. You have a beautiful machine. I too have the same one. I found it at a local thrift store. I'm pretty excited to start cleaning and getting it going. I already own 3 other vintage Kenmore's so it will be fun to see what this old gal can do. Thanks for the quick history lesson on this beauty.

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  7. Anybody know where to buy a belt for this thing? Websites list it as 14 3/8", but it's really 12 3/8' x 3/16" wide. I haven't found anybody that can help.

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  8. If the web site suppliers don't list the machine (try http://www.sewingpartsonline.com/sewing-machine-belts.aspx) you can do your own conversion; 12 3/8' is a 1238 belt size, a 12 1/2 is a 1212. you only have to be close because the motor adjusts plenty.

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    1. I already bought one from them, but it's 1/4" wide rather than 3/16". Unfortunately web sites don't list the width. I'll try calling them again, but they weren't very helpful without being able to look up the machine.

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    2. Hi Tom, I Have one of these I am selling. it was grandmas and she has passed. any idea what it is worth? I also have a morse for sale

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    3. Wondering if any of you will see this. And if so, has anyone located a belt. I have the Model 117.840 and I cannot find a V belt to fit my machine. Very frustrated.

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    4. Mbrandt...I found a guy on Facebook who has a ton of parts for this machine. Look up Fred Sanford's Sewing Machine Parts on Facebook. He will find you the parts if he can, he found a belt for mine and now it works!

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    5. I will follow up on that! Thank you!

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  9. I think I have this sewing machine?!!? the only model number I can find is on the table it pops out of :/ but that number is 566.1406 and I can't find that anyplace. The plate on the back of the motor does not have a model number. It only has the volts, wattage and such.....The machine looks just like this one. The peddle does not reach the floor. It fits in a bracket under the table and you operate it with your knee. If anyone knows if I have a different model then what is on this blog, please let me know :) Thank you.

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  10. want to buy a copy of the instruction manual for this machine mstew@gvtc.com

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  11. I have this Kenmore 117.841 model FOR SALE!
    Includes:
    ** MANUAL / FOOT PEDAL / CAMS / 7 AST BOTTOM ATTACHMENTS
    ** COMPLETE CABINET WITH LEGS / DRAWERS / FOLDING TABLE
    I am not a sewing person, make me a legit offer... lets get it sold!
    Thanks

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    1. Please email me at d.juliano1965@gmail.com

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    2. Just curious for how much $$ you ended up selling the machine?

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    3. Just curious for how much $$ you ended up selling the machine?

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    4. Not sold yet. Make an reasonable offer! :)

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  12. I cannot reassemble the bobbin assembly after oiling on my 117.840. Could you send me a pic of yours? I will give email if needed. Thanks!

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  13. Hey Penny!
    I am glad that you caught this now... I have a buyer coming today to hopefully purchase.
    I do not know this machine, but am willing to take a few pics and send them to you.
    Let me know asap

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  14. Hi everyone, I inherited a "white " sewing machine, it is green. Model #666, it says made in Western Germany. It has everything including the cams and feet, it is in a cabinet. It is dual voltage. I tried contacting Husquavarna, they didn't have any information. Any ideas as to what its worth? Or who would buy it?

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  15. I forgot to put that I also have the manual.

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  17. Hi I have this machine model 177. 841 Kenmore and I am looking for a double welt foot for upholstery. I have a lot of attachments and none look like the double welt foot. A side note this was my grandmother's machine which she purchased new in the 1950's. She has kept it pretty clean and oiled regularly I know that I'm going to need a belt soon so I would appreciate any information as to where I could get a belt. Thank you!

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    1. Hi, this is a long shank machine so any long shank attachments should / might work. Try any thing you find the height is the least of the issues, the important thing is the location of the hole so turn the machine by hand to be certain the needle passes clean thru the hole.

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  19. @Janny Lee - I have this machine as well and it uses 'high' (or 'long') shank feet - not to be confused with Kenmore's later offered 'super high shank' feet and attachments. 'High' shank feet are used a great deal in industrial machines. There are a number of web-based merchants of feet, attachments, and supplies for industrial machines that can supply your industrial high shank double welted cording foot. Happy hunting!

    John Thomas in NC

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  20. Just bought a 117.841 kenmore with all the attachments and accessories . Location terre haute Indiana. make offer.

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  21. I inherited my Mother's 1958 Kenmore. But, unfortunately I did not inherit the instruction manual (it was nowhere to be found among her things). Does anyone know where I can get one?

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    1. I bought a manual from relics@charter.net. But I can't find out what bobbin to buy. Can anyone tell me?

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  23. Brian M.
    My Mom has one of these sewing machines and it's in a blond wood cabinet.

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  24. The Kenmore 84 machine was sold to Sears by White and made by GH in Germany for the zigzag and external cam capability. White has there own series called an Automatic model 651 with a few extra features. The external fancy stitch cams are unique in size and hard to find. I had to make an adapter so I could fit other Pfaff cams on the machine. I will sell the adapter if interested.

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    1. Thanks
      I had such high hopes for this machine, it is an impressive piece of engineering, however, I could never get reliable stitching on leather which is my number one use, so its going into the "to be sold" pile

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    2. Hi. My Model #117.841 came with no foot pedal (or knee thing) so I'm not sure it even works. The light does come on when plugged in, so that seems like a good start! Can anyone tell me what foot pedal I need to buy for this model? Is there such a thing as a generic foot pedal that will work, or will I need to luck out and find an old original one (and of course, model# for what I need either way)? Thanks Much. debbie.

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    3. Almost any Kenmore pedal with the 3 prong plug will work
      Ebay or other such places, The plug is the unique part, any foot pedal from 1920 till recent should work.

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    4. Thank you, Tom. Very helpful. I wasn't sure where to even start with this before finding you!

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    5. ps...I am so impressed! Checking out your shoes...love those boots. I can't even imagine "making shoes". That's talent.

      I remember that stove/oven too, btw. The stovetop more so than the oven. We didn't have it. I think it was someone I used to babysit for. You took me back...pulling that cooktop out to use it :)

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  25. My mother gave me her 117.841 and it's the only sewing machine I've ever used. I'm lucky to have all of the attachments and manual. Just started quilting and I'm looking for a "walking foot." Has anyone purchased one for this machine? Any help would be greatly appreciated! Thanks, Barb

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    1. hi, can you buy me or give me pictures of the instructions manual? I live in South America and here is so complicated find it.
      constanzacuellar1127@gmail.com

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  26. hello, please which type of needle may I use for this machine. my husband just got one and I do not have idea which type of needle we try the brother's needle ones but didn't work. Thank you

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    1. Standard domestic needles
      They have a flat on one side

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  28. Does anyone know where I can find a replacement belt for this machine? I was just given this very one but it seems to be missing the belt

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    1. Any style belt that is the correct length
      There are posts that show how to measure
      Any sewing supply shop should have spare belts

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  29. Hellp. I'll try posting again. Can anyone help me at all? Would be much appreciated. My grandmother, original owner, has this exact machine. One owner, perfect condition. Just hasn't been used in over a decade. She has owners manual, original replacement parts (belts, bobbine winder rings? and boxes of things I have no idea) Any ideas on how to sell this or the parts? She was going to just set it outside and I said NOOOO! It looks perfect. Thanks everyone. Oh, I have lots of pictures of it, the stand its in, pedals, replacements parts, book.

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    1. Sadly they are just not worth a fortune, so Craigslist is the easy option but put it to SELL
      Ebay requires shipping and could yeald a higher price, but requires shipping

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  30. I have one as well in beautiful +(tigerwood?)cabinet, tons of parts, and grandma likely only owner. While not worth a fortune, I would appreciate a ballpark opinion on sale price/value as well.

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  31. my daughter lost the hinges to attach sewing machine to the cabinet. any idea on where to buy or pictures

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  32. I was lucky enough to be given this exact machine, but someone took the tension assembly apart and I can't get it back together properly and I'm not sure it's all there. A diagram would be greatly appreciated and a place to get tension parts would help in case they aren't all there.

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  33. have model 111 motor is weak, armator looks ok ,brushs to , any suggestions ?
    jerry bldbufalo@hctc.net

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  34. I have this beautiful machine, that was handed down to me from my Great Grandmother. I'm trying to do some research, and bring her back to life. One piece of information I can't seem to find is what Cams fit this machine. From what I can gather some of them are interchangeable. Do you have any advice? How do I know which cams would fit this machine?

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    1. It takes type F Black Cams. This is the original set of cams that comes with the 117.841: https://www.vintagesingerparts.com/products/vintage-original-set-of-eight-stitch-cams-fits-kenmore-model-117-740-117-841?variant=30298613088354

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  35. Tom I'm looking to buy this exact machine -- any chance you are willing to part with this one? The original post is 8 yrs old at this point, so hoping you still get this message. - Ed edmathie@gmail.com

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  36. Hi Ed, I have a Kenmore 117.840 and might sell it. Emailing you now.
    Sylvie

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  37. To anyone who is interested I have a Kenmore 117. 841 for sale.... any offers?

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  38. Does any one know where I can purchase a belt from a reputable dealer for my 117.841 Kenmore?

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    1. By any chance have you found a compatible motor belt for the 117.841 machine yet? I've been on the hunt for a replacement belt for quite some time and hoping you found more information on where and what to purchase to fit this machine? TIA :)

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  39. Does anybody have any recommendations on how to fix your bobbin when it is all zigzagged

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